World Of Prophecy

World of Prophecy => Exposé - Where Satan's Best Tricks are Exposed => Topic started by: SoftTouch on July 11, 2007, 02:30:35 PM

Title: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on July 11, 2007, 02:30:35 PM
What is the New Apostolic Church?  It involves a combination of these: 5 fold ministry; latter rain; third wave; contemplative spirituality; new prophets; Church Growth; Purpose Driven; Kingdom Now; Dominionist Theology; Kansas City Prophets; Vineyard Movement and other Apostacies.

The "New Apostolic" church movement

What if someone came along and said we have been doing church without a true foundation. That unless we install this missing part we will not succeed. The answers to the greatest revival in history are going to be found in this missing part. Does this sound like an implausible claim? We are going to look at this very claim used for a unique movement that is now growing.

A National Symposium on the Post-Denominational Church was convened by Dr. C. Peter Wagner at Fuller Seminary, May 21-23, 1996. Bill Hamon said that this was a historical occasion in God's annals of Church history. It was prophetically orchestrated by the Holy Spirit to fulfill God's progressive purposes of bringing His church to its ultimate destiny... the consensus of the panelists was that there are still apostles and prophets in the Church, and there is an emerging Apostolic Movement that will revolutionize the 21st Century Church (Streams, Rivers, Floods, Avalanches, cited by Jewel van der Merwe, Discernment Ministries Newsletter,

(Please read article at above link.)

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Chipper on July 11, 2007, 09:46:37 PM
thank you for that S.T. I read the lot and I am pleased to see you put plenty of names in there too, for us to "watch out for"

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on July 11, 2007, 09:53:49 PM
thank you for that S.T. I read the lot and I am pleased to see you put plenty of names in there too, for us to "watch out for"

I can't take credit Sis, this is from the Discernment Ministry "Let Us Reason" and most likely written by Mike Oppenheimer - A Brother With Excellent Discernment! :)

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: WaitWatchPray on July 12, 2007, 05:28:47 AM
More and more oil for tickling ears, no?  :'(


Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on August 01, 2007, 10:15:58 PM
Bro Manny has found an 'Apostolic Ministry' called "Identity Network" that is Primed and Ready for the coming Deception of the Fallen Angels 

Angelic Encounters of Light, Fire, and Wind (

Church history has many great supernatural ministers like William
Branham and Katherine Kuhlman.  They tuned their ears to hear, and
their hearts to perceive the angelic messengers sent to direct them
into the Holy Spirit flow.  They were given insights, revelation, and
power to navigate the heavenly dimensions which released the
miraculous to move across the sea of humanity attending their crusades.  By waiting upon the Lord until they sensed the fiery
presence of the angels they released heavens atmosphere on
earth.   Do you want to encounter angels? 

Brilliant heavenly lights, luminaries or orbs, are appearing as they did
in Acts 20:8-10 and Job 29:2-6.  When the beautiful hosts are present, resurrection life- giving, creative, miracle-power is released.  Their presence is drawn through the creative atmosphere of preaching the word, prayer, faith and worship.

Here is Acts 20:8-10 (;&version=9;)  Where does this talk about Beautiful Hosts or Orbs?  It says many lights in verse 8 only and does not elaborate At All about them being anything other then Oil Lamps.

Here is Job 29:2-6 (;&version=9;)  Here again is another HUGE Stretch of Scripture (or should I say Twisting) :(

Oy Vey! :(  No, I don't want to encounter Angels I want to see my Lord and Savior Coming In The Clouds With Power and Glory!  I don't need 'supernatural manifestations' and 'lying signs and wonders'   I have the Faith The Lord Gave Me in things Unseen yet Believed  on Jesus Christ and HIS Finished Work at the Cross.  That's all I need.

It is So Sad to see this! 

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Chipper on August 02, 2007, 02:29:12 AM

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: O3Airfilter on August 02, 2007, 11:38:33 AM
Hi all

ST, t'nx for the postings. The New Apostolic Church is a nice name for the New Apostate Church. Watch out!!! This is something from the Oral Roberts University (Apostate).

Holy Spirit Research Center
The Origins of the Pentecostal Movement


The Pentecostal movement is by far the largest and most important religious movement to originate in the United States. Beginning in 1901 with only a handful of students in a Bible School in Topeka, Kansas, the number of Pentecostals increased steadily throughout the world during the Twentieth Century until by 1993 they had become the largest family of Protestants in the world. With over 200,000,000 members designated as denominational Pentecostals, this group surpassed the Orthodox churches as the second largest denominational family of Christians, surpassed only by the Roman catholics. In addition to these "Classical denominational Pentecostals," there were over 200,000,000 "Charismatic" Pentecostals in the mainline denominations and independent charismatic churches, both Catholic and Protestant, which placed the number of both Pentecostals and charismatics at well over 420,000,000 persons in 1993. This explosive growth has forced the Christian world to pay increasing attention to the entire movement and to attempt to discover the root causes of this growth.

Although the Pentecostal movement had its beginnings in the United States, it owed much of its basic theology to earlier British perfectionistic and charismatic movements. At least three of these, the Methodist/Holiness movement, the Catholic Apostolic movement of Edward Irving, and the British Keswick "Higher Life" movement prepared the way for what appeared to be a spontaneous outpouring of the Holy Spirit in America.

Perhaps the most important immediate precursor to Pentecostalism was the Holiness movement which issued from the heart of Methodism at the end of the Nineteenth Century. From John Wesley, the Pentecostals inherited the idea of a subsequent crisis experience variously called "entire sanctification,"" perfect love," "Christian perfection," or "heart purity." It was John Wesley who posited such a possibility in his influential tract, A Plain Account of Christian Perfection (1766). It was from Wesley that the Holiness Movement developed the theology of a "second blessing." It was Wesley's colleague, John Fletcher, however, who first called this second blessing a "baptism in the Holy Spirit," an experience which brought spiritual power to the recipient as well as inner cleansing. This was explained in his major work, Checks to Antinominianism (1771). During the Nineteenth Century, thousands of Methodists claimed to receive this experience, although no one at the time saw any connection with this spirituality and speaking in tongues or any of the other charisms.

In the following century, Edward Irving and his friends in London suggested the possibility of a restoration of the charisms in the modern church. A popular Presbyterian pastor in London, Irving led the first attempt at "charismatic renewal" in his Regents Square Presbyterian Church in 1831. Although tongues and prophecies were experienced in his church, Irving was not successful in his quest for a restoration of New Testament Christianity. In the end, the "Catholic Apostolic Church " which was founded by his followers, attempted to restore the "five-fold ministries" (of apostles, prophets, evangelists, pastors, and teachers) in addition to the charisms. While his movement failed in England, Irving did succeed in pointing to glossolalia as the "standing sign" of the baptism in the Holy Spirit, a major facet in the future theology of the Pentecostals.

Another predecessor to Pentecostalism was the Keswick "Higher Life" movement which flourished in England after 1875. Led at first by American holiness teachers such as Hannah Whitall Smith and William E. Boardman, the Keswick teachers soon changed the goal and content of the "second blessing" from the Wesleyan emphasis on "heart purity" to that of an "enduement of spiritual power for service." Thus, by the time of the Pentecostal outbreak in America in 1901, there had been at least a century of movements emphasizing a second blessing called the "baptism in the Holy Spirit" with various interpretations concerning the content and results of the experience. In America, such Keswick teachers as A.B. Simpson and A.J. Gordon also added to the movement at large an emphasis on divine healing "as in the atonement" and the premillenial rapture of the church.

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Since Pentecostalism began primarily among American holiness people, it would be difficult to understand the movement without some basic knowledge of the milieu in which it was born. Indeed, for the first decade practically all Pentecostals, both in America and around the world, had been active in holiness churches or camp meetings. Most of them were either Methodists, former Methodists, or people from kindred movements that had adopted the Methodist view of the second blessing. They were overwhelmingly Arminian in their basic theology and were strongly perfectionistic in their spirituality and lifestyle.

In the years immediately preceding 1900, American Methodism experienced a major holiness revival in a crusade that originated in New York, New Jersey and Pennsylvania following the Civil War. Begun in Vineland, N.J., in 1867 as the "National Holiness Camp Meeting Association," the holiness movement drew large crowds to its camp meetings, with some services attracting over 20,000 persons. Thousands claimed to receive the second blessing of sanctification in these meetings. Leaders in this movement were Methodists such as Phoebe Palmer, (also a leading advocate of womens' right to minister); John Inskip, a pastor from New York City, and Alfred Cookman, a pastor from New Jersey.

From 1867 to 1880, the holiness movement gained increasing force within the Methodist churches as well as in other denominations. During this period, many holiness advocates felt that this movement might revive the churches and bring new life to Christi-anity worldwide. After 1875, the American holiness movement, influenced by the Keswick emphasis began to stress the pentecostal aspects of the second blessings, some calling the experience "pentecostal sanctification." An entire hymnody was produced which focused on the upper room and a revolutionary "old-time pentecostal power" for those who tarried at the altars. Practically all the hymns of the early Pentecostal movement were produced by holiness writers celebrating the second blessing as both a cleansing and an enduement of power.

The holiness movement enjoyed the support of the churches until about 1880 when developments disturbing to ecclesiastical leaders began to emerge. Among these was a "come-outer" movement led by radicals who abandoned any prospects of renewing the existing churches. Led by such men as John B. Brooks, author of The Divine Church, and Daniel Warner, founder of the "Evening Light" Church of God in Anderson, Indiana, this movement spelled the beginning of the end of the dream of remaking the churches in a holiness image. At the same time, other radicals began promoting such new teachings as "sinless perfection," a strict dress code of outward holiness, "marital purity," and a "third blessing" baptism of fire after the experience of sanctification.

The first Pentecostal churches in the world were produced by the holiness movement prior to 1901 and, after becoming Pentecostal, retained most of their perfectionistic teachings. These included the predominantly African-American Church of God in Christ (1897), the Pentecostal Holiness Church (1898), the Church of God with headquarters in Cleveland, Tennessee (1906), and other smaller groups. These churches, which had been formed as "second blessing" holiness denominations, simply added the baptism in the Holy Spirit with glossolalia as "initial evidence" of a "third blessing."

Pentecostal pioneers who had been Methodists included Charles Fox Parham, the formulator of the "initial evidence" theology; William J. Seymour, the pastor of the Azusa Street Mission in Los Angeles who spread the movement to the nations of the world; J.H. King of the Pentecostal Holiness Church, who led his denomination into the Pentecostal movement in 1907-08; and Thomas Ball Barratt, the father of European Pentecostalism. All of these men retained most of the Wesleyan teaching on entire sanctification as a part of their theological systems. In essence, their position was that a sanctified "clean heart" was a necessary prerequisite to the baptism in the Holy Spirit as evidenced by speaking in tongues.

Other early Pentecostal pioneers from non-Methodist backgrounds accepted the premise of second blessing holiness prior to becoming Pentecostals. For the most part, they were as much immersed in holiness experience and theology as their Methodist brothers. These included C. H. Mason (Baptist), of the Church of God in Christ, A.J. Tomlinson (Quaker), of the Church of God (Cleveland, Tennessee), B.H. Irwin (Baptist) of the Fire-Baptized Holiness Church, and N.J. Holmes (Presbyterian) of the Tabernacle Pentecostal Church. In the light of the foregoing information, it would not be an overstatement to say that Pentecostalism, at least in America, was born in a holiness cradle.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: O3Airfilter on August 02, 2007, 11:43:20 AM

Origins of Pentecostalism

The first "Pentecostals" in the modern sense appeared on the scene in 1901 in the city of Topeka, Kansas in a Bible school conducted by Charles Fox Parham, a holiness teacher and former Methodist pastor. In spite of controversy over the origins and timing of Parham's emphasis on glossolalia, all historians agree that the movement began during the first days of 1901 just as the world entered the Twentieth Century. The first person to be baptized in the Holy Spirit accompanied by speaking in tongues was Agnes Ozman, one of Parham's Bible School students, who spoke in tongues on the very first day of the new century, January 1, 1901. According to J. Roswell Flower, the founding Secretary of the Assemblies of God, Ozman's experience was the "touch felt round the world," an event which "made the Pentecostal Movement of the Twentieth Century."

As a result of this Topeka Pentecost, Parham formulated the doctrine that tongues was the "Bible evidence" of the baptism in the Holy Spirit. He also taught that tongues was a supernatural impartation of human languages (xenoglossolalia) for the purpose of world evangelization. Henceforth, he taught, missionaries need not study foreign languages since they would be able to preach in miraculous tongues all over the world. Armed with this new theology, Parham founded a church movement which he called the "Apostolic Faith" and began a whirlwind revival tour of the American middle west to promote his exciting new experience.

It was not until 1906, however, that Pentecostalism achieved worldwide attention through the Azusa Street revival in Los Angeles led by the African-American preacher William Joseph Seymour. He learned about the tongues-attested baptism in a Bible school that Parham conducted in Houston, Texas in 1905. Invited to pastor a black holiness church in Los Angeles in 1906, Seymour opened the historic meeting in April, 1906 in a former African Methodist Episcopal (AME) church building at 312 Azusa Street in downtown Los Angeles.

What happened at Azusa Street has fascinated church historians for decades and has yet to be fully understood and explained. For over three years, the Azusa Street "Apostolic Faith Mission" conducted three services a day, seven days a week, where thousands of seekers received the tongues baptism. Word of the revival was spread abroad through The Apostolic Faith, a paper that Seymour sent free of charge to some 50,000 subscribers. From Azusa Street Pentecostalism spread rapidly around the world and began its advance toward becoming a major force in Christendom.

The Azusa Street movement seems to have been a merger of white American holiness religion with worship styles derived from the African-American Christian tradition which had developed since the days of chattel slavery in the South. The expressive worship and praise at Azusa Street, which included shouting and dancing, had been common among Appalachian whites as well as Southern blacks. The admixture of tongues and other charisms with black music and worship styles created a new and indigenous form of Pentecostalism that was to prove extremely attractive to disinherited and deprived people, both in America and other nations of the world.

The interracial aspects of the movement in Los Angeles were a striking exception to the racism and segregation of the times. The phenomenon of blacks and whites worshipping together under a black pastor seemed incredible to many observers. The ethos of the meeting was captured by Frank Bartleman, a white Azusa participant, when he said of Azusa Street, "The color line was washed away in the blood." Indeed, people from all the ethnic minorities of Los Angeles, a city which Bartleman called "the American Jerusalem," were represented at Azusa Steet.

The place of William Seymour as an important religious leader now seems to be assured. As early as 1972 Sidney Ahlstrom, the noted church historian from Yale University, said that Seymour was "the most influential black leader in American religious history." Seymour, along with Charles Parham, could well be called the "co-founders" of world Pentecostalism.

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The first wave of "Azusa pilgrims" journeyed throughout the United States spreading the Pentecostal fire, primarily in holiness churches, missions, and camp meetings. For some time, it was thought that it was necessary to journey to California to receive the "blessing." Soon, however, people received the tongues experience wherever they lived.

American Pentecostal pioneers who received tongues at Azusa Street went back to their homes to spread the movement among their own people, at times against great opposition. One of the first was Gaston Barnabas Cashwell of North Carolina, who spoke in tongues in 1906. His six-month preaching tour of the South in 1907 resulted in major inroads among southern holiness folk. Under his ministry, Cashwell saw several holiness denominations swept into the new movement, including the Church of God (Cleveland, Tennessee), the Pentecostal Holiness Church, the Fire-Baptized Holiness Church, and the Pentecostal Free-Will Baptist Church.

Also in 1906, Charles Harrison Mason journeyed to Azusa Street and returned to Memphis, Tennessee to spread the Pentecostal fire in the Church of God in Christ. Mason and the church he founded were made up of African-Americans only one generation removed from slavery. (The parents of both Seymour and Mason had been born as southern slaves). Although tongues caused a split in the church in 1907, the Church of God in Christ experienced such explosive growth that by 1993, it was by far the largest Pentecostal denomination in North America, claiming some 5,500,000 members in 15,300 local churches. Another Azusa pilgrim was William H. Durham of Chicago. After receiving his tongues experience at Azusa Street in 1907, he returned to Chicago, where he led thousands of mid-western Americans and Canadians into the Pentecostal movement. His "finished work" theology of gradual progressive sanctification, which he announced in 1910, led to the formation of the Assemblies of God in 1914. Since many white pastors had formerly been part of Mason's church, the beginnings of the Assemblies of God was also partially a racial separation. In time the Assemblies of God church was destined to become the largest Pentecostal denominational church in the world, claiming by 1993 over 2,000,000 members in the U.S. and some 25,000,000 adherents in 150 nations of the world.

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In addition to the ministers who received their Pentecostal experience at Azusa Street, there were thousands of others who were indirectly influenced by the revival in Los Angeles. Among these was Thomas Ball Barratt of Norway, a Methodist pastor later to be known as the Pentecostal apostle to northern and western Europe. Receiving a glossolalic baptism in the Spirit in New York City in 1906, he returned to Oslo where he conducted the first Pentecostal services in Europe in December of 1906. From Norway, Barratt traveled to Sweden, England, France, and Germany, where he sparked other national Pentecostal movements. Under Barratt such leaders as Lewi Pethrus in Sweden, Jonathan Paul in Germany, and Alexander Boddy in England were brought into the movement.

From Chicago, through the influence of William Durham, the movement spread quickly to Italy and South America. Thriving Italian Pentecostal movements were founded after 1908 in the USA, Brazil, Argentina, and Italy by two Italian immigrants to Chicago, Luigi Francescon and Giacomo Lombardy. Also, in South Bend, Indiana (near Chicago) two Swedish Baptist immigrants, Daniel Berg and Gunnar Vingren, received the pentecostal experience and felt a prophetic call to Brazil. Their missionary trip in 1910 resulted in the formation of the Brazilian Assemblies of God, which developed into the largest national pentecostal movement in the world, claiming some 15,000,000 members by 1993. Also hailing from Chicago was Willis C. Hoover, the Methodist missionary to Chile who in 1909 led a pentecostal revival in the Chilean Methodist Episcopal Church. After being excommunicated from the Methodist Episcopal Church, Hoover and 37 of his followers organized the "Pentecostal Methodist Church" which by 1993 grew to number some 1,500,000 adherents in Chile.

African Pentecostalism owed its origins to the work of John Graham Lake (1870-1935), who began his ministry as a Methodist preacher but who later prospered in the business world as an insurance executive. In 1898 his wife was miraculously healed of tuberculosis under the ministry of divine healer Alexander Dowie, founder of a religious community called "Zion City" near Chicago, Illinois. Joining with Dowie, Lake became an elder in the "Zion Catholic Apostolic Church." At one point, Lake testified to an instant experience of entire sanctification in the home of Fred Bosworth, an early leader in the Assemblies of God. In 1907, he received the Pentecostal experience and spoke in tongues under the ministry of Charles Parham, who visited Zion while the aging Dowie was losing control of his ministry. Out of Zion also came a host of almost 500 preachers who entered the ranks of the Pentecostal movement, chief of whom was John G. Lake.

After his Pentecostal experience, Lake abandoned the insurance business in order to answer a long-standing call to minister in South Africa. In April 1908, he led a large missionary party to Johannesburg, where he began to spread the Pentecostal message throughout the nation. Coming with him was his wife and seven children as well as Holiness evangelists Thomas Hezmalhalch and J.C. Lehman. Only Lehman had been to Africa before 1908, having served for five years as a missionary to the Zulus. Hezmalhalch, lovingly known as "Brother Tom," was born in England and was sixty years of age when he arrived in South Africa. Before the end of his first year in South Africa Lake's wife died, some believed through malnutrition. Lake nevertheless succeeded in founding two large and influential Pentecostal churches in Southern Africa. The white branch took the name "Apostolic Faith Mission" (AFM) in 1910, borrowed from the name of the famous mission on Azusa Street. This is the church that eventually gave David duPlessis to the world as "Mr. Pentecost." The black branch eventually developed into the "Zion Christian Church" (ZCC) which by 1993 claimed no less than 6,000,000 members and, despite some doctrinal and cultural variations, was recognized as the largest Christian church in the nation. In its annual Easter conference at Pietersburg, this church gathers upwards of 2,000,000 worshippers, the largest annual gathering of Christians on earth.

After his African missionary tour of 1908-1912, Lake returned to the United States where he founded churches and healing homes in Spokane, Washington, and Portland, Oregon, before his death in 1935. Throughout the rest of the century, Pentecostal denominational missionaries from many nations spread the movement to all parts of Africa. In addition to the AFM and ZCC churches, the Pentecostal Holiness Church in South Africa was founded in 1913 under the leadership of Lehman, who had come with Lake in 1908. In 1917, the Assemblies of God entered South Africa when the American church accepted the mission already established by R.M. Turney. The Church of God, (Cleveland, Tennessee) came to the country in 1951 through amalgamation with the Full Gospel Church. In retrospect, the work of Lake was the most influential and enduring of all the South African Pentecostal missions endeavors. According to Cecil Rhodes, the South African "Empire Builder," "His (Lake's) message has swept Africa. He has done more toward South Africa's future peace than any other man." Perhaps the highest accolade was given by no less a personage than Mahatma Ghandi who said of Lake, "Dr. Lake's teachings will eventually be accepted by the entire world."

Soon after Lake returned to the United States, the movement reached the Slavic world through the ministry of a Russian-born Baptist pastor, Ivan Voronaev who received the Pentecostal experience in New York City in 1919. Through prophecies, he was led to take his family with him to Odessa in the Ukraine in 1922, where he established the first Pentecostal church in the Soviet Union. Although he was arrested, imprisoned, and martyred in a communist prison in 1943, Voronaev's churches survived incredible persecution to become a major religious force in Russia and the former Soviet Union by 1993.

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This first wave of Pentecostal pioneer missionaries produced what has become known as the "Classical Pentecostal Movement" with over 11,000 Pentecostal denominations throughout the world. These continued to proliferate at an amazing rate as the century came to an end. In retrospect, the pattern established in South Africa was repeated in many other nations as the movement spread around the world. That is, an enterprising Pentecostal pioneer such as Lake broke the ground for a new movement which was initially despised and rejected by the existing churches. This phase was followed by organized Pentecostal denominational missions efforts which produced fast-growing missions and indigenous churches. The final phase was the penetration of Pentecostalism into the mainline Protestant and Catholic churches as "charismatic renewal" movements with the aim of renewing and reviving the historic churches.

Strangely enough, these newer "waves" also originated largely in the United States. These included the Protestant "Neo-pentecostal" movement which began in 1960 in Van Nuys, California, under the ministry of Dennis Bennett, Rector of St. Marks Episcopal (Anglican) Church. Within a decade, this movement had spread to all the 150 major Protestant families of the world reaching a total of 55,000,000 people by 1990. The Catholic Charismatic Renewal movement had its beginnings in Pittsburgh, Pennsylvania, in 1967 among students and faculty of DuQuesne University. In the more than thirty years since its inception, the Catholic movement has touched the lives of over 70,000,000 Catholics in over 120 nations of the world. Added to these is the newest category, the "Third Wave" of the Spirit, which originated at Fuller Theological Seminary in 1981 under the classroom ministry of John Wimber. These consisted of mainline Evangelicals who moved in signs and wonders, but who disdained labels such as "pentecostal" or "charismatic." By 1990 this group numbered some 33,000,000 members in the world.

In summary, all these movements, both Pentecostal and charismatic, have come to constitute a major force in Christendom throughout the world with explosive growth rates not seen before in modern times. By 1990, The Pentecostals and their charismatic brothers and sisters in the mainline Protestant and Catholic churches were turning their attention toward world evangelization. Only time will reveal the ultimate results of this movement which has greatly impacted the world during the Twentieth Century.

This posting is from "their" side. Note how nicely the Catholic Church stepped in.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on August 02, 2007, 02:25:48 PM
2 Thessalonians 2:8And then shall that Wicked be revealed, whom the Lord shall consume with the spirit of his mouth, and shall destroy with the brightness of his coming:

 9Even him, whose coming is after the working of satan with all power and signs and lying wonders,

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on August 02, 2007, 04:45:28 PM   (Thanks to Bro Manny for finding this site!)

The Latter Rain Doctrine
Compiled By Ed Tarkowski

The distinctive teachings of the Latter Rain that have so penetrated the Charismatic Renewal, Pentecostalism, and the Restoration Movement. Supposed Scriptural basis: Joel 2:23; Hosea 6:3; James 5:7:

REPLACEMENT - the Church replaces Israel. For instance, Latter Rain sees the dead dry bones of Ezekiel 37 as the Church, the New Israel, who will live because God is putting His Spirit into them. Consequently, Israel no longer has a major role to play in the endtime scenario.

FORMER RAIN - Latter Rain doctrine: teaches that the NT Pentecost was the "former rain," leaving the "latter rain" yet to come.

LATTER RAIN - Latter Rain doctrine: since Pentecost is considered the "former rain," it is only fulfilled in the Church's later celebration of the Feast of Tabernacles, which replaces Pentecost as the "latter rain" of Joel 2:23.

TABERNACLES - the celebration of this feast, says Latter Rain, fulfills these phases: unity, the "latter rain" revival, harvest, defeat of the Church's adversaries, establishment of the Kingdom. Tabernacles is understood spiritually as the Harvest Festival of joy and gladness; thus it is likened to the current laughing phenomena.

Also considered to be the invisible and spiritual coming of Christ to indwell His corporate body, as opposed to Pentecost, when he indwelt individuals. This coming of Christ to indwell His corporate body is now being expressed through "new truths": God is impregnating His Church to "raise up" Joel's Army, and thus the means to bring in the Kingdom of God.

RESTORATION - Latter Rain bases its concept of restoration on Acts 3:21: Jesus can't return until all things are restored. The primary need is restoration of the 5-fold ministry (Eph. 4:11-12), especially the offices of Apostles and Prophets. These would bring about the perfection of the saints.

REVELATIONS - the new, progressive revelations of the Latter Rain Apostles and Prophets by which the saints will reach a state of sinless perfection. The Scriptures are allegorized or spiritualized. Church direction is also delivered through these "new, sacred truths."

IMMORTALITY - Latter Rain teaches that as the saints reach a state of sinless perfection, death is overcome. These are the Manifest Sons (Romans 8:19), who attain immortality by incarnating Christ before Christ returns. Signs and wonders will be wrought by the Manifest Sons of God, leading to a glorious worldwide endtime harvest.

UNIFICATION - corporately, the Manifest Sons of God are known as Joel's Army. The Church's unity on a global basis is absolutely essential to Latter Rain doctrine, because Christ cannot incarnate in a divided body.

ESCHATOLOGY - in Latter Rain doctrine, Jesus cannot physically return until the Church has torn down, and taken the place of, demonic powers in the heavenlies. The warfare is territorial in nature. Having overcome death, the members of Joel's Army will then reign until all God's enemies, including the last enemy of death, are destroyed and the earth is made a footstool for His feet. The Tribulation is replaced by a period during which the Manifest Sons execute God's judgment and cleanse the earth of evil in order to establish the Kingdom of God. Latter Rain discounts the classic understanding of the Second Coming, the Millennium, and the Premillennial Rapture doctrines.

RELIGIOSITY - the religious "Old Generation," the denominational Christians who reject the new teachings by holding to the "old way," will not enter in to "possess the land" nor achieve "fullness." According to Latter Rain, these will be destroyed during the "Tribulation," while Joel's Army reigns from the heavenlies. As the ongoing incarnation of Christ, the Manifest Sons will have the power to judge God's enemies and cleanse His Church by destroying all who refuse to "repent".

EVOLUTION - the Latter Rain doctrine presupposes that the Church must progress in maturity to reach a point where Christ can incarnate His body in order to establish His Kingdom on earth before His physical return. But Scripture says Christians "have come to fullness of life in Him," which means that we are complete in Him (Colossians 2:10). We need only to learn to walk in our new life.

In his book, "Weighed and Found Wanting . . . Putting the Toronto Blessing in Context," Bill Randles writes on pages 58-59:

"An interesting example of the evolutionary model of the church is a little book written in 1951 by George Warnock called 'The Feast of Tabernacles.' This book is a virtual primer of Latter Rain, Manifested Sons of God teaching, . . . a pattern for the progress of the church through time. Starting at Passover, which is Calvary, the church has been passing through the different feasts, over the years, to Pentecost. Warnock writes that we, the church, still have got to go through the Day of Atonement, the Feast of Trumpets, and come into the Feast of Tabernacles, which to him represents God's consummate purposes for us, the Last Days Church. When we come into Tabernacles, which was a tremendous time of celebration for Israel, God will finally dwell within His people."


(There is a Load of Information on The Latter Rain Movment here: )

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on August 02, 2007, 04:55:40 PM  (Thanks to Bro Manny for finding this site!)

Scripture On Which The Movement Is Based
By Mary Tarkowski

The Latter Rain movement teaches that God's outpouring of His Spirit at Pentecost was the "former rain" mentioned in Joel 2:23. According to this teaching, the "latter rain" is still to come in the last days. Built on this doctrine are numerous other teachings, particularly those promising the restoration of apostles and prophets, new revelations by these men, the literal perfection of the endtimes saints and their manifestation as Sons of God, and the restoration of the world as God's Kingdom on earth, ruled by Christ's corporate body, in preparation for Jesus' second coming.

Considering the extraordinary nature of these teachings, and the fact that they so contradict classic, historical Christian doctrine, we should look into the Scriptures on which the Latter Rain doctrine is supposedly based.

God's promise of former and latter rains is first given in Deuteronomy 11, as Israel is preparing to enter the promised land.:

13 And it shall come to pass, if ye shall hearken diligently unto my commandments which I command you this day, to love the Lord your God, and to serve him with all your heart and with all your soul,
14 that I will give you the rain of the land in his due season, the first rain and the latter rain, that thou mayest gather in thy corn, and thy wine, and thine oil.

Seven hundred years later, despite Israel's continued unfaithfulness and arrogance, the people assumed that after two or three days of repentance, God would restore His blessing to them as surely as He had sent the former and latter rains:

1 Come, and let us return unto the Lord: for he hath torn, and he will heal us; he hath smitten, and he will bind us up.
2 After two days he will revive us; in the third day he will raise us up, and we shall live in his sight.
3 Then shall we know, if we follow on to know the Lord; his going forth is prepared as the morning; and he shall come unto us as the rain, as the latter and former rain unto the earth" (Hosea 6).

Again, this reference to rains is anything but a promise from God to twice pour out His Spirit in the former and latter days.

A third scripture reference, from the book of Joel, is one most often quoted by Latter Rain teachers. In Acts 2, Peter declared that Pentecost was the fulfillment of Joel 2:28-32 ("And afterward, I will pour out my Spirit on all people . . .") But confusing the latter DAYS with the latter RAIN, teachers of the Latter Rain movement take verses 23 and 24 out of their own context and apply them to the promise in verses 28 through 32. A straight reading of these verses, however, indicates nothing more than their literal meaning. Because of Israel's repentance, God will again bless them with regular rainfall, resulting in abundant crops:

23 Be glad then, ye children of Zion, and rejoice in the Lord your God: for he hath given you the former rain moderately, and he will cause to come down for you the rain, the former rain, and the latter rain in the first month.
24 And the floors shall be full of wheat, and the vats shall overflow with wine and oil.

The last reference to latter rain is found in the New Testament. Writing to Christians suffering at the hands of the world, James encourages them to have patience in the face of such adversity:

7 Be patient therefore, brethren, unto the coming of the Lord. Behold, the husbandman waiteth for the precious fruit of the earth, and hath long patience for it, until he receive the early and latter rain. 8 Be ye also patient; establish your hearts; for the coming of the Lord draweth nigh.

Rather than promising a second outpouring of the Holy Spirit resulting in immortal Manifest Sons of God conquering and ruling the world before Christ's return, James points to the PATIENCE of the husbandman, or farmer. Jesus described such a farmer in Mark's gospel:

26 And he said, So is the kingdom of God, as if a man should cast seed into the ground;
27 And should sleep, and rise night and day, and the seed should spring and grow up, he knoweth not how.
28 For the earth bringeth forth fruit of herself; first the blade, then the ear, after that the full corn in the ear.
29 But when the fruit is brought forth, immediately he putteth in the sickle, because the harvest is come (Mark 4).

According to Jesus, the Kingdom of God will not be set up by men, but by God himself when the time of the harvest, or judgment, has come. In the meantime, the Kingdom is established in men's hearts as they believe the gospel and patiently allow the Holy Spirit to produce fruit within.

In the only spiritual sense allowed by these verses, the former and latter rain, as well as the ground itself, are those circumstances which God uses to bring forth fruit in our lives. He sent Israel the literal rain in due season in order to provide for His children in their land, and now He sends the figurative rain to provide us with spiritual growth. In other words, the Latter Rain movement has no scriptural basis even for its foundational teaching. It stands to reason, then, that all the other doctrines built on its non-existent base are actually hanging in mid-air.

Mary Tarkowski


(Much More Info on the Latter Rain Movement Here: )

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on January 01, 2008, 04:29:35 PM

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Pete on January 03, 2008, 09:12:55 AM
Excellent article, Sis!

Trying to explain the nuances of the CPM using respected Christian leaders is difficult, because their reputation blinds some people to the bad substance underneath.  This article is powerful in that it not only exposes the very bad mystic underpinnings, but it does so through one who is obviously misguided to start with.  As such, it really shines a light on the heresy being taught.

Thanks a ton.  I passed it along to a couple people who I hope will read and pray through it.

Peace in Christ,


Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Caretaker on January 03, 2008, 02:45:11 PM
God bless you Sis;

You are a true Watchman on the Wall, and your gift of discernment a true blessing to us all.

I was Pentecostal for several of my early years in Christ. First responding during a Charismatic Crusade, and continuing to seek after the experiential. I was a member of the Full Gospel Business Men's Fellowship International, founded by Demos Shakarian,(The Happiest People on Earth). I think I still have the pin in my desk drawer. His roots were from Pentecostal Armenians who had fled persecution in the 1800's, and flowing through Azuza Street.

I was strongly influenced by such authors as:

Don Basham,"Face Up With a Miracle", "Deliver Us From Evil"

John Sherill's, "They Speak With Other Tongues", and the story of Harold Bredesen the mainline Lutheran pastor who experienced the baptism of the Holy Ghost, and was influential in Pat Robertson and Pat Boone receiving the same experience. Harold was one of the founding board members of CBN. He also was a mover in deliverance ministries.

Fr. Dennis Bennett, "Nine O'Clock in The Morning", "Holy Spirit and You" was the Episcopal priest who was a seminal figure in the Charismatic Renewal movement of the 60's. An influential bridge with Roman Catholic Charismatics.

David Wilkerson, "The Cross and the Swichblade"

Over 25 years ago I met a Baptist Brother Joe and his love of our Lord, and his ministry to our family, (although we were divided on tongues and the Spirit Baptism), led me to begin studies at the feet of Bible scholars. I came to understand the errors which plagued my theology, and for the last 20+ years I have sought to be grounded in the Word. It was like a drunkard being set free, and walking in sobriety with my Lord Jesus Christ.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on January 03, 2008, 02:51:03 PM
Over 25 years ago I met a Baptist Brother Joe and his love of our Lord, and his ministry to our family, (although we were divided on tongues and the Spirit Baptism), led me to begin studies at the feet of Bible scholars. I came to understand the errors which plagued my theology, and for the last 20+ years I have sought to be grounded in the Word. It was like a drunkard being set free, and walking in sobriety with my Lord Jesus Christ.

 :whoopie)  PRAISE JESUS CHRIST!!!! 

I wouldn't call myself a 'Watchman' but rather more a Watchman's Helper... more like a very alert Sheep  :sheep) Or even Sheepdog (as one of my old pastors used to refer to me LOL)

I wish I possessed the extensive knowledge of our Heavenly Fathers Precious Word (The Bible) that the Watchmen who write these articles do!  I truly intend to work on that  :thumbup) :praying) :read)

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Pete on January 03, 2008, 05:17:43 PM

I had hopes with that article!  I sent a link to some believers I care about, but they weren't very interested...  Here is part of the email I got back:

The article refers to Mike Bickle from International House of Prayer, International House of Prayer ( if you really want to know what he believes go to the web site and read core beliefs and statement of faith. We are just too busy to keep reading articles by outsiders constantly misquoting others.  I did read their statement of faith at Hungry Heart and the statement of faith at Mike Bickle's at IHOP and they are virtually identical.  As for Rick Warren, he had an hour-long special on Fox news Christmas Eve and he explicitly outlined the plan of salvation.  I have a copy if you ever want to see it. (italics and bold are mine)...

They used to be at Saddleback and no one can tell them anything negative about that church or RW!  To their credit they have a strong evangelistic outreach in the community, but they refuse any questioning of their course material...  I asked a few questions about Beth Moore's Be Still video they were showing.  That was incredibly poorly received...  I am not sure how to get through to them.  They see everything as a conspiracy against the great ministry of RW and Saddleback.

God help us!



Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on January 03, 2008, 05:25:07 PM
Oh Bro that is so Sad :(   I just don't understand why people are unwilling to look at the evidence?  Anyone can write an accurate Statement of Faith, but What Do They Preach?  Does it Line Up?  Not exactly a Berean way of Testing :(

I can identify with what you must be feeling right now... been there with SODC  :'(  It just makes me want to CRY!

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: chatty-kathi on June 12, 2008, 08:25:07 AM

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Daisy on June 12, 2008, 08:59:19 AM
Sister Kathi,

This is very interesting news about the NAC.
After watching this revolting revival in TV, your insights cause me to pause.
If Hamon and this movement are not "THE False Prophet", they surely are like its image!

I have been following FP for some time, especially the news that they think the final seven years have begun 2007, as well as their very compelling evidence about
Solana and all things EU.

I am not as sure of this as they are but certainly am very alert to their message.
If they are correct the next 2 1/2 years are going to be quite hair raising.
Watching the world stage right now i can agree things are set and the stage is so very ripe for the fulfillment of Daniel and the Revelations, as well as the Olivet Discourse given to us by Jesus.

Holly is so very right in her warning about the false prophet!
We are all on high alert for this one!

 :blessyou)  in the name of :Jesus)

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Barry on June 12, 2008, 10:26:01 AM
A little more on Hamon;

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on June 12, 2008, 10:56:13 AM

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Daisy on June 12, 2008, 11:06:58 AM
Have been thinking about Hamon and the NAC.

Although they certainly follow in the image of the false prophet described in
Revelation 13 :11-18, at this time I do not think it fits the description the beast from the earth but certainly is a part of its body. (IMO)

Revelation 13: 11-18
13:11 And I beheld another beast coming up out of the earth; and he had two horns like a lamb, and he spake as a dragon.
13:12 And he exerciseth all the power of the first beast before him, and causeth the earth and them which dwell therein to worship the first beast, whose deadly wound was healed.
13:13 And he doeth great wonders, so that he maketh fire come down from heaven on the earth in the sight of men,
13:14 And deceiveth them that dwell on the earth by the means of those miracles which he had power to do in the sight of the beast; saying to them that dwell on the earth, that they should make an image to the beast, which had the wound by a sword, and did live.
13:15 And he had power to give life unto the image of the beast, that the image of the beast should both speak, and cause that as many as would not worship the image of the beast should be killed.
13:16 And he causeth all, both small and great, rich and poor, free and bond, to receive a mark in their right hand, or in their foreheads:
13:17 And that no man might buy or sell, save he that had the mark, or the name of the beast, or the number of his name.
13:18 Here is wisdom. Let him that hath understanding count the number of the beast: for it is the number of a man; and his number is Six hundred threescore and six.
This beast has great authority (given to it by the beast from the sea) as to cause
ALL to be marked with the number of the beast 666.
Its characteristics:
1)  2 horns like a lamb= religious figure that has the image of a Christian
2)  exercises ALL authority of the first beast= relgious power supported by world
3)  power to make the people of the earth to worship it
4)  works great signs= fire coming down from heaven to earth in the sight of men
5)  uses these great signs to deceive the people
6)  cause the people to make an image of the beast from the sea( which was
     wounded by the sword [war?] and yet survived and lived from this wound
7)  gives breath to the wounded beast who lived TO SPEAK
8   cause ALL who would not worship the image (it made of the first beast)
     to be SLAIN.
9)  causes ALL to be marked on the right hand or forehead with 666 in order
     to buy or sell (survive)

This beast from the earth is a powerful beast who has global religious authority and is does the biddance of the first beast in whom it gets its power!


Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on June 12, 2008, 12:38:46 PM
Sounds like a good discussion for another thread Sis ;)  Let's keep this one on the N.A.R. (Latter Rain etc.) and Exposing their Apostacies and we can discuss the Prophecy part in a different thread.  If you'll start it, I'll put a link to it here :)

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on June 12, 2008, 03:03:22 PM
As you may know, F.P. believes the final seven years may have begun Jan. 1, 2007, which began the strengthening of the Barcelona Process through the European Neighborhood Policy, which is a seven year agreement with a review period in 2010.  

No, I didn't realize that ???  I guess I haven't had time to do much reading over there.  But I can't say I'm in agreement that the above mentioned Barcelona Process being the 'Covnant with the many' of Daniel...  Yet I can't say I know much about the B.P. either.  Unless it has a Direct effect on Israel and the ability (or permission) for them to rebuild the Temple and re-institute the daily sacrifices... Then I might think it possible.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on June 12, 2008, 09:27:13 PM
Just read Holly's Commentary:

A commentary was made after this posting by Holly Pivec at Fulfilled Prophecy, link .

Very Good!

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on June 13, 2008, 02:29:35 PM
Sis Kathy - Thank you for that Info on Solana, the A.O.C., Recommendation 666 and the Barcelona Process!  I Split it out and moved it here:

This topic has been moved to The Original Eastwood's World of Prophecy Forum ( (

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Daisy on June 13, 2008, 02:48:35 PM
 :blessyou) Kathi,

You have shared some great sites and information for us all.

My loving thanks to you.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: SoftTouch on June 13, 2008, 10:32:01 PM
Y'all might also want to look through this thread:   Signs & Wonders and False Teaching of the Charismatic Movement(s) ( as there appears to be a connection between this N.A.R. and the others listed in the above blue link.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: chatty-kathi on June 18, 2008, 07:57:56 AM
Here is a good article from John MacArthur called, "Are Experiences a Valid Source of Truth?"  The link is .

The article is based on his upcoming book in 2009 called Charismatic Chaos.  It will be an update to his 1977 book, The Charismatics.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: Caretaker on June 18, 2008, 08:45:57 AM
Here is a good article from John MacArthur called, "Are Experiences a Valid Source of Truth?"  The link is .

The article is based on his upcoming book in 2009 called Charismatic Chaos.  It will be an update to his 1977 book, The Charismatics.

God bless you Sis;

A truly powerful read, and strikes right at the heart of the matter:


My experience and your experience is not the test or proof of Biblical truth, it is the reverse--Biblical truth must validate or invalidate any experience. Doctrinally, it is almost impossible to define the Charismatic movement. It almost resists theology. It resists categorization because it has such a wide and growing spectrum of viewpoints. If they don't rightly divide the Word of God they are not going to come to a proper Systematic Theology. If they determine what is true because of their own experiences then there is no limit to the theology; it will take whatever form experience takes. And so what you have is a very amorphous kind of volatile changing systems of beliefs that ebbs and flows and rises and falls and refuses to find any structure.

The Charismatic movement is achieving, by the way, what the liberal Ecumenical movement tried for years to achieve, and that is a unity that is indifferent to doctrinal truth. And so I say there is intimidation as we approach this study because we are not supposed to have the right to do this, since we haven't had the experience. We are not suppose to do it because it isn't loving and it isn't gracious and it doesn't make for unity. And so, I just want you to know that I acknowledge the effort to intimidate, and I reject that. I do not believe, furthermore, that I have to have some kind of experiences in order to understand what the Bible says about them. I haven't walked on water, but I can understand what it says when it says that Jesus did.

Doctrinally, we must have structure, we must have sound doctrine. We cannot fall prey to a system that resists any doctrinal categorization. But see, once you allow experience to be the test of truth, then you can't limit doctrine to the pages of Scripture.


It was in April 1977 that I first came to Christ, and I walked through the Pentecostal/Charismatic experience before coming solidly to the Word and coming-out of experiential deception.

Thank you for sharing, and I want to add that you are a blessing to our fellowship.

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: chatty-kathi on June 18, 2008, 09:50:05 AM

Title: Re: What is the New Apostolic Church?
Post by: kaijuu on April 21, 2009, 06:59:37 PM
is this related to a so called G12 movemente ? have you heard about it , I had not time to chack all other post yet, but it seems that this is money doctrine , among ritual practisews , are mining small churches among latin america, this G12 ask the leaders and priests to get asosiated, and I read that most of the churches get twice the people , but they end closed , or the leaders turn to this strange doctrine etc.